Mr. Incredible

Hello Everyone:

I am searching for some owner feedback on the 2009 TL (specifically the SH-AWD model).

I am currently driving a highly modified Chrysler 300C and am now in the market to sell it and replace it with something more practical,

I have narrowed my decision down to:

Lexus GS350
MB E350
Audi A6


but then I saw the new 2009 TL and it caught my eye...

today (Saturday) I spent most of the day doing some comparative test drives..

I lucked out that the Acura Dealer near me happened to have a 2006 E350 and a 2007 GS350 on the used car lot, and since the 2006/2007 of these models doesn't really differ much from the 2009 I was able to test drive them and the 2009 TL back to back...

This was a real head turner for me, as I have never considered owning a FWD or transverse AWD vehicle, I have always been a RWD kinda guy.

Even more so, this is my first venture outside of an American car company, and the Cadillac CTS would be at the top of my list, but I just can't see myself buying a car from GM while they are in their current financial situation, this is also the reason for my decision to sell the Chrysler, it has been an excellent vehicle for 4 years, but Chrysler has no real future and I need to know the car company backing my warranty will exist tomorrow.

So here I am searching for The Good, The Bad, and The Indifferent on the TL.

so please share your thoughts

Marc...

bmode

We have a quite a few threads here on the forum already discussing the cars you mention and their differences. It's a rather heated discussion, check them out just incase this thread gets closed.

Well, in my opinion, you can't lose with any of those rides, they're all sweet! It's a nice dilemma to have, I envy your choices! Just to give you my feedback, I've had Honda's for the last 20 years, and have zero serious issues! The Acura's I've had are stable, reliable and fun to drive, especially this new TL. The AWD is something special if you like to whip around turns at 35mph as the suspension really does push you down instead of body roll. The FWD is a bit softer but is a little lighter and a recreational version of the AWD, that was my choice. It's a smoother ride for me as I entertain in my car and need more luxury and less sport, but it's no punk, it's actually just as fast as the AWD. The stock wheels on the FWD are hideous, so change might be necessary to improve the appearance for some. The inside of both AWD/FWD is superb! I never want to get out of my car, and get the Tech package as the media connectivity is perfect for me! The iPhone just pops up in the Nav screen!

Just my two cents, and I'm not going to comment on the other cars, other than the Lexus, that is a sweet car, but my neighbor has one, and she's 67. Now the IS350 is sportier, but a little too small for me. Good luck, and I hope this helps.

Mr. Incredible

thank you bmode;


yes the IS350 is a nice vehicle, and the IS-F was a choice until I sat in it.. being 6'2" and 260lbs with a Titanium Right Hip, it was not a comfortable car..

this is also the reason the A6 was axed, though a very nice vehicle, the short test drive left my leg feeling numb and in some discomfort.


the TL test drove nice, the seats are comparable to the SRT version seats I installed in my 300C (as the OEM seats where too flat).

I will defiantly be going with the AWD and the Technology package, I don't wish to lose any of the features and integration I have on the 300C, speaking of which:

My 300C sync's with my Ipod and I can control the Ipod via the cars steering controls and radio interface, and the songs, playlists etc display on my GPS unit..

is this possible in the TL? or do I have to load everything to the HDD, also has anyone set up a rear entertainment system in the TL, I have a 4 year old and having her own TV in the headrests is a god-send on long trips.

Colin

You can control your iPod with the car's audio system. You cannot move MP3s to the build in HDD. You can only rip CDs to the HDD, probably for copywrite reasons.

KeithL

Here my extensive review on my SH-AWD

https://acurazine.com/forums/4g-tl-2009-2014-123/my-first-week-my-sh-awd-long-post-sorry-709165/

The one observation I would say is the others you are looking at in my opinion are ina higher class than the TL AWD, but all in all the AWD TL is an awesome ride with awesom features, especially if you don't mind the exterior styling.

PsychDoc

GS350

Pros - great gas mileage, legendary Lexus reliability, intuitive (if somewhat understated) controls, plain Jane but very high quality interior, touch screen nav system.

Cons - it's a friggin' hatchback dude (!!!), cramped interior, virtually unuseable rear seat, small trunk space, not a true sports sedan, a good deal of body lean in turns, price can get up there with the German offerings with option packages (which you sound like you want).

M-B E350 (I assume you mean the 2009 model year as the 2010 won't even be available until July/Aug)

Pros - it has a 3-pointed star on the hood, almost perfect combination of ride comfort and sportiness/lack of body lean (M-B seems to get suspensions "right" better than any other manufacturer), great front seats, reasonably comfortable and roomy rear seats, nice trunk space, it's a pretty car, reliability has come up to 'average' of late, great steering and brakes, attractive interior aesthetically

Cons - controls are amazingly unintuitive and horribly labeled, nav system is an embarrasement for a 21st century car, audio system is mediocre at best, option packages will run the price up to the mid/upper $50's, A/C anemic in the summer, engine is not a real free rev'er, front passenger has very limited foot room, tech features clearly lagging competitors.

(Note: this applies only to the 2009 car....the incoming 2010 car is an amazing vehicle and may well be your ticket to nirvana if you have close to $60k to spend....I carefully checked it out at the recent NYC auto show....it's a winner in every regard other than the engine which is going to be a carry-over.)

Audi A-6

Pros - gorgeous car inside and out, class leading interior quality re: materials and aesthetics, finally enough power to make the car get up and go with the new 3.0 supercharged engine, cavernous rear seat accommodations, great front seats.

Cons - can get expensive with option packages (no longer the bargain among the German offerings it once was), dated tech features, mediocre audio system, typical German unintuitive controls and switchgear, horrible nav system and low rez screen, hard ride (but if you're looking at the SH-AWD TL I guess this won't bother you), reliability just so-so, not terrific gas mileage.

TL

Pros - awesome value, state of the art tech features, intuitive control layout, absolutely gorgeous interior (as long as you're not expecting wood), simplicity of options (i.e. 'tech or no tech'...that's the only choice you'll have to make), great power, ridiculously great handling in the SH-AWD car, every tech feature anyone could possibly want, legendary Acura reliability, superb brakes, very comfortable front seats (not quite up to M-B standards, but close), roomy rear seats.

Cons - steering is a bit numb and twitchy, trunk is a bit small (especially in the SH-AWD car), ride can be too firm for some (again, this applies to the SH-AWD car), gas mileage not great, you don't get a presigious German logo on the hood or trunk and oh, have I forgotten to mention "THE BEAK?" (you either love it or hate it...I'll leave it at that....but you can always get it in Palladium Metallic which kind of blends in with the color of the 'beak'....that's what I did).

Mr. Incredible

thank you PsychDoc:

Faux wood is not an issue for me.. I worked very hard to remove all of it from my 300C I hated it..

as for the German name plate.. meh/... I could care less.. it's not the name plate for me.. (hell I drive a Chrysler now) it's the options, feel, reliability, and over all presence of the vehicle.

the TL sticks out, just like the 300 did when it first came out.. it's different..

I like the harsh curve design, and the overall presence of the TL.. not fond of the front grille, but that can be changed..

I've never kept a vehcile Stock, it's just my nature to change and mold the vehicle into something that represents me..


this is my car now:



imagine what I will do to the TL.. (though I think not to the extent of the 300C)

PetesTL

Wow! ...that 300C looks sick!.....looks like something out of a Robocop movie!

Mr. Incredible

thanks, lots of time and effort into that creation..

that picture there was the one Chrysler used for their official 2009 Mopar Calendar.

here are a few more:

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

I personally don't really like 300C...but man..yours is just stunning. Great work!!

snax

Looks like it has escaped from a stalker and slasher movie!

ardenne90

It looks like Mr. Incredible is not credible on this one. The wonders of web 2.0 - anyone can own their dream car at the click of a mouse.


quote of the day: "If wishes were horses beggars would ride"

Mr. Incredible

you think so:

check my photobucket http://s9.photobucket.com/albums/a53/mjeds/new%20paint/


or search my username: Mr. Incredible

on

www.300cforums.com
www.lxforums.com

sorry pal, that car is mine, it does exist in that form and I can prove it..


no photoshopping except for removing some blemishes for the calendar photo in the first image..

name any way you want me to prove it and I can..


2005 Satin Black 300C custom...

I got a list of mods a mile long.....

kabota

Considering this was your first post and your calling someone out for not being credible, how bout you show us the link or how you make this accusation?

Mr. Incredible

thank you Kabota..

like I said, that car exists in that form and I can prove it.. I spent a lot of time and effort creating that beast..

I have no reason to lie about it......


if you search the 300c forums links I provided, you will find that I am very well known and very well respected in the Mopar world...

tmnhs81

I have nothing to say about TL but Thats best looking 300 I have ever seen. Still ing over it. Thanks for a great desktop wallpaper..

Mr. Incredible

no problem.. if you want a hi-res 2440 x 1900 of it let me know in a few days when I can accept PM's

tmnhs81

That will be great. Thanks.

GearDriven

Of the ones you mentioned the TL is the most RWD-like in handling.

lpe387tt

All of the cars you mentioned other than the TL that you were interested in have their ups and downs. With the TL, I found that for all that you get in the vehicle (Dollar for Dollar) those other cars don't come close. You will be very happy should you choose to go with the TL, but you won't go wrong with the other cars of choice either.

The TL is contagious IMHO. I look forward to getting into it everyday. Value, advanced technology, reliability, performance, safety...........All Good with the TL. PsychDoc's write up on the Pro's and Con's was very very good. I would agree with most if not all of the things he mentioned.

Also, your 300c is an awesome looking machine. Very nice work. Hope you become a happy TL owner in the near future.

guytdt

Bought TL last weekend and love it so much. Get it, you won't regret.

ardenne90

Lighten up, that was just a joke. Your toy kicks ass!

sbas

That 300 looks, well incredible! Not too many cars can pull off the BMW "rings" but you implemented the look very well. Is that matte finish hard to keep clean?

Mr. Incredible

um yeah mmmmmmmkay.. no problem, and thanks.



actually no, it's very easy..

mild soap or no soap and water.. then wipe dry.

twice a year I use a special wax for Matte Paint to protect it from UV damage, but I don't ever have to polish it..

I do use some furniture polish on it at shows to bring out the black luster, but for daily driving just wash and dry (can't let the water dry on the paint, water spots are a biatch to get out).

zippy

We went from the gen. to gen. 4. Over the years we've had a 528 and a GS300, no Benzs, and lots of other cars.

Before the the current TL our favorite car (other than my S2000) was our 94 Legend GS, but the our current TL is the best car we have owned in quite some time. The ride is solid, but not harsh and handling is great.

As far as reliability, we've had ~15 Honda and Acura products since 79 and reliability is a given.

Mr. Incredible

yes, after owning a Chrysler (which is a love/hate relationship) Reliability is very high ranking on my list..

Lexus was my first choice because my GF has had 2 Toyotas since 1994 and they have both been great, however IMO the GS line doesn't hold a candle to the comfort of the new TL , which is very important to me because of my disability, matched with the reliability and a stand out of the crowd design the TL is capturing my eye..

I am finalizing the sale of my 300C this week, and my other toy (custom chopper/motorcycle) next weekend.. once both are done, I will have cash in hand to make my purchase, I am going to be paying cash in full for the car, no financing and that is another high point of interest..

buying the TL new I have a 4 year warranty, and a new car with no issues, buying a used vehicle for the same price who knows what issues I will have, and I will have little to no warranty unless I purchase a service contract out of pocket..

lots of things to consider, and the TL comes to the top of my list for most...

Going to have to test drive it again methinks, just to be 100% certain... but I'm 95% there..

PetesTL

Just curious Marc, why are you selling your beloved and highly-modded 300C? You've definately spent a lot of money and time on it and the looks are stunning.....is it due to reliability problems?

Mr. Incredible

no not really, the 300c has mostly been good to me, it did have an electrical issue that took 17 dealer trips to finally get Chrysler to replace the body harness and since then it has been solid..

the motor/trans etc have never given me any issues..

this is the longest I have ever kept a vehicle, going on almost 5 years (bought it in May 2004) usually I turn over about every 3 years..

I am changing gears and looking for a reliable and technologically advanced daily driver I don't need to think about so I can start working on this:


this isn't my actual 1949 Caddy, I don't have a digital picture of mine.

and turn it into something like this:







My GF's brother also left behind a 1967 GTO when he passed away, it has been sitting in her fathers garage for almost 30 years untouched (which we discovered recently when her father passed, no one knew it was there), and she wants to rebuild it..

so I have some projects to work on..

the 300 was a show car, but is past it's day now, and is my DD and it's time to move on..

that and someone made me an offer on it I couldn't refuse..

tmnhs81

that caddy is amazing. Good luck.

candymanjl

posted this in another thread but it applies here too...

I looked at and drove the Lexus IS350, Audi A4, the BMW 335i coupe and sedan, and 535i sedan. I went into my car search biased towards the 335i and the IS350 and ended up with the TL.

interior...
fit and finish wise I'd say the only thing that is on par with the TL is the BMW. I'd honestly say they're just as good as each other with the edge going to the TL's tech package, that's much better than any of the cars. the IS350 and A4 just didn't seem as nice. from the plain plasticy parts to the uncomfortable seats I wasn't impressed with the A4 and the IS350. the IS350 with the touch screen navi is cool, saves you from mousing around with the navi. but the car feels crowded with the center dash so close to you to put the system into arm's reach, catch 22.

performance...
the 335i is by far the best, can't argue that. especially when intake, chip, and exhaust can get you 400+whp. the IS350 would be the next best mainly since it's so much lighter than the TL. the A4 I was in was the 2.0L turbo and that was horrible. the V6 version might be better but advertises 40 less hp than the TL and I didn't drive it so I can't say. also the TL's drive by wire throttle is the best I've ever driven, it's as seamless as a conventional throttle cable would be and it allows the system to rev match shifts which is cool. want to drive a horrible drive by wire system drive the audi and you'll see how good the TL is.

comfort...
the TL was the most comfortable by far. the A4, IS350, and 335i's (even the 4 door) are all much smaller inside so I felt a lot more cramped inside, especially with other people in the car. you end up bumping elbows with your passenger when driving. all good if it's your girlfriend, not cool when it's your boy the A4's suspension is really rough, surprisingly so for a "luxury" car, definitely the worst I drove. you also have more storage space in the TL than any of the cars, the trunk is huge! basically the size and weight that hurts performance makes up for it in comfort and storage.

price...
equip each car equally and the TL SH AWD with tech package is the best deal. the 335i and 535i are over $50k by the time you get the comfort access, navi, power everything, etc. the audi is creeping on $50k with all the tech toys and V6. the lexus IS350 is $45ish to equip it like the TL SH tech.

I really wanted the 335i coupe just for the performance. in the end I couldn't justify spending another $10,000 just to be faster but it would be a lot of fun maintenance was also a big thought. with a honda/acura you just don't worry about that stuff. on the BMW they include everything for the first 50,000 miles which is cool but I don't want to go to the dealer and get stuff fixed all the time, which is inevitable on a BMW. audi and lexus are decent build quality wise but you'll end up at the dealer before a honda/acura for sure.

anyway, hope that helps, I really went to acura just to look at the TL and had no intention of buying it walking in. after driving everything else first then getting into the TL realizing it was the nicest of the group on the inside (IMO), still decently quick, honda quality, and the cheapest, I was sold and the AWD system does let it handle surprisingly well, it's not just a gimmick. I just went to deals gap with the car and I was keeping up with civic's and RSX's through mountain roads, pretty fun

in the end, get what you like and can afford and enjoy it. if that's a TL, cool, if that's something else, as long as you like it, cool.

Mr. Incredible

Candyman:

those observations are very close to my thoughts when comparing the TL to the other models I was looking at..

I was very Biased to the GS-series Lexus, I have been looking at that for a long time, and imagine my disappointment when test driving the TL right after (like within 5 minutes) having never even thought about the TL knowing nothing about it.

it was so far superior of the GS (the GS styling is dated now) and the price is significantly less than a new GS (I was settled on a 2006 model used) that I can afford a new TL vs a 3 year old GS..

I've pretty much decided on this car, soon as my buyer picks up the 300C Friday, and my Motorcycle Buyer on Tuesday...

I'm going shopping.....