Bearcat94

^^

The difference is these guys stayed with the stock wheel (17 x 8) and went from a 235 width to a 255 width.

Plus sizing is moving from stock 17" wheel to a larger wheel, say, 18", while maintaining the stock diameter. Plus sizing is more about getting a bigger wheel (18" or 19" for the TL). Plus 1 is going to 18", Plus 2 is going to 19".

To maintain the stock diameter with a bigger wheel, you have to go to a smaller section height. So 235/45/17 in a Plus 1 size might be 245/40/18.

BEAR-AvHistory

Has anyone had any problems getting the 255/40/17 installed on the 8 inch rim?

S PAW 1

^
Do you mean finding shops that will install them? I know it's a long thread, but quite a few have. Most shops won't accept the liability. Some don't mind.

NBP04TL4ME

No problems whatsoever

I bought the tires from the Tire Rack and had them shipped to a local shop. They installed them, no questions asked. The sales rep I spoke with at the Tire Rack said that he didn't have anything that said that this size would fit, but if I knew the would fit (thanks AZ), he would sell them and ship them.

Good Luck!!

BEAR-AvHistory

Will let you know how it works out..tires should be in next week.

NBP04TL4ME

What tires did you buy?

BEAR-AvHistory

255/40/17 Yokohama AVS ES100.

Ramrodthrusterpuppy

Anyone with pix of the 255/40/17 on a TL-S?

S PAW 1

I don't know if the author has a TL or TL-S, as it's debadged. Check out the first page of the thread. Look would be the same.

Busted again [lol!]

frenchbiker

Would 255/45-17 tires fit without rubbing?

Ramrodthrusterpuppy

Yeah...ya got me!
His ride is a base TL, just wanted to see what the wider shoes looked like on the TL-S wheels.

nhousepro

All this talk about I got this tire and that tire...but no one is posting pics!!!! Post pics!!!

S PAW 1

See post #1 for answer.





Post pics!!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All this talk about I got this tire and that tire...but no one is posting pics!!!! Post pics!!!

I counted over 20 pics on the first page!

S PAW 1

They've got to look great.
For me though, it'll be 245/40/17's when ready for new shoes.
I'm not much of a risk taker. The 255's aren't much wider. That's just me, though.

BEAR-AvHistory

Generally yes.

That being said you really need to get the exact measurements of the tires you are buying before you buy them since most will vary in size.

For example the guy who started the thread got 255/40/17 Goodyear Eagle F1 (D3). I got 255/40/17 Yokohama's

The Goodyear puts down a tread width of 8.7" while the Yokohama has a tread width of 9.8" or over an inch bigger.

So you can see why even though the tires are nominally the exact same size they are not. So once again before you put down your money measure your current clearances, get the exact measurement of your current tires & the exact measurements of the tires you like.

nhousepro

Will a 255/35-18 tire work on an a 18x8 wheel? Or is it better to go with a 235/40-18?

frenchbiker

Wouldn't a 255/45-17 look beefier? The 17" rim is kinda small, so if you put a 40 tire, it will leave a big gap between the tire and the fender. Just my opinion.

BEAR-AvHistory

There is less then 1/2 inch height difference between the 255/40 & the 235/45 factory summer tire or base tire on the TL.

That suggests that the fender clearance will change by less then a 1/4 inch, but the tire cross section will increase from 9.2" to 10.4" & tread width will increase from 8.3" to 9.8"

Also the next bigger tire in the AVS ES 100 line is a 275/40/17 which is way to big (wide) for the stock rim to operate safely.

Inaccurate

I am "the guy who started the thread".

A few quick comments.

1) I would say that the 255/45 will fit (speculation on my part). The 255/40 has mega clearance on my oem (100% stock suspension) 2006 TL (Not a TL-S). Just ask the store what their return policy is just in case.

2) The 255/40 will increase the gap in the wheel well slightly. So, if you are sensitive to having too much gap, then I would advice not getting the 255/40.

3) I agree that different tire brands/types differ in the exact physical size. I just purchased a 245/40 (yes, I said 245/40, not 255/40) as a spare tire to keep on-hand in case I need to quick replacement. I am going with the 245/40 instead of my beloved 255/40 because I get a lower gear ratio, better braking leverage, lighter weight, and stiffer sidewall. To my amazement, the Goodyear F1-D3 245/40 has the same thread width as the Goodyear F1-D3 255/40, just a shorter sidewall.

BEAR-AvHistory

Hi Guy

This is an important point that shows how you can get different results with different tire brands & different series with in the same tire brand.

In the AVS ES-100 line the 245/40 & 45 have the exact same tread width of 9.4 inches. The height is 25.6" for the 45 & 24.7" for the 40.

So in the case of these tires a 245/45 will fill the wheel well a little better, give you more tread width on the ground and a slightly poorer gear ratio then a stock replacement.

The ES-100 235/45/17 (Acura stock size) tread width is 9.1 inches & has a height of 25.4" which makes the 245/40 slightly shorter then stock & the 245/45 slightly taller.

To make matters more interesting the Acura (OE) factory installed summer tire option Bridgestone Potenza RE030 235/45/17, which I have now. has only an 8.3 tread width & a height of 25.5 so an exact replacement with a ES-100 235/45/17 would put all most an inch more rubber on the ground with no change in tire height.

BTW I have been running the ES-100 in a 225/45 - 245/40 stagger on my BMW 330CI for the last 25K miles & the ES-100's are true summer tires with phenomenal grip when they are warm & don't want to be anywhere near snow, ice or freezing weather.

This works for me because I have 2 4X4's for the small amount of really crappy weather we get in Carolina. The thing here is, if you have cold bad weather where you live, you need to be very, very honest with yourself about summer tires if the TL is your only or most important source of transportation.

Up North, I was born & raised in Jersey, true summer tires can be very dangerous to your health as they have zero traction in snow & ice. They are also marginal in very cold wet weather.

For summer tires - buyer beware.

ctoro99

Bear -AvHistory

Just to be clear on this, you're saying that a 255/40/17 Yokohoma ES-100 will put more than 1" of thread on the road than the Goodyear F1 the exact same size? Does the tire itself look that much bigger than the F1 on the car? As say, looking at it from the back?

I thought that the with measurement of 255 mm is the same 255mm regardless of brand. Am I way off on this?

P.R.E.A.M.

that is the measurement from side wall to side wall not the read width

Bearcat94

The 255 (or 245 or 235, etc) is the SECTION width. That is the width of the tire at it's widest point. Different tires/brands won't be EXACTLY 255, but they'll be close.

TREAD width is different than SECTION width and (as shown) can vary widely between tires/brands. This seems to be a function of design differences in the Tread Width, Shoulder and Sidewall.

Regarding this thread (putting 255's on 8" rims):

In general a wide tire (255) on a slightly narrow rim (8") needs more sidewall support (40 v 35). IOW - on an 8" rim 255/40 is "better" than 255/35.

Neither combination will be recommended by most tire manufacturers. They want you to have a minimum 8.5" rim for 255's.

P.R.E.A.M.

also here is another thing about "THREAD WIDTH" between different tire manufactures

BEAR-AvHistory

Yes its about an inch wider in its contact patch.

I have ES-100 245/40's on the rear of my BMW 330 & 225/45 on the front. The tread width on the ground measured with a ruler is just under 9 inches for the 225 & just under 9 an a half inches for the 245.

The 225 on the front of the BMW at 8.7 is wider then the 235 stock summer tire at 8.3 on the TL & its easy to see the difference.

I hope to get the 255's on tomorrow & will post a few pictures.

BEAR-AvHistory

Optional factory 235/45/17 Summer tires.


ES100 255/40/17


ES100 255/40/17


12" ruler

No problem at all getting them installed. I got them from Tire rack but few of the local tire dealers sell this size for the TL.

Bearcat94

Looking good!

Side Shot (for the sidewall/fender gap) ??

Are you dropped? Looks like some negative camber, but hard to tell how much.

BEAR-AvHistory

Ride height is stock as are all suspension settings.

chill_dog

Since we're all requesting pics, can you take a 3/4 shot?

BEAR-AvHistory

Maybe in the morning..would have to play musical cars to get enough room do it now.

Bottom line its a very subtle difference (except for the tread pattern) from stock which is what I was looking for.

That being said if its parked next to a TL with stock tires you can see they are much wider but just about the same overall height.

S PAW 1

Ok Bear...it looks good.
I have to ask you....why did you did decide to go with the 255's?

BEAR-AvHistory

HeHeHe, yeah I did think the 255's were a bad plan when this thread first came out.

A few things entered into my choice but the main one was the lack of a significant difference in cross-section which would effect both sidewall flex & the stability of the contact patch.

When I priced the 245's I found out the 255's were exact the same price as the 245/45/17's that I expected to buy & in some cases the 255 came out as a recommended upgrade over the stock & 245 tire. This made me look into it a little more.

When I checked the numbers the actual cross-section was about 6/10ths of an inch wider for the 255 over the 245.

Also, the 255 did not seem to be grossly oversize because its is less then an inch wider in crosssection then the 235 stock replacemnet.

The final push was a number of the tire shops here in Raleigh like Discount Tires list the ES-100 255/40/17 as a replacement. Tire Rack had no problem with the size even though there was no finincial incentive to them to go with a bigger tire; only potential liability & Merchants Tire had no issues with installing them.

Had the section width been greater I would have definatly gone with the 245's.

This all comes back to my earlier post about none of these tires by different manufactures being the same in real life even though the are listed as being the same in the general spec 235/45/17, 245/45/17 or 255/40/17 etc.

There are any number of 255's with 10+ inch cross-sections that are definatly to big for the stock 8" rim so you have to check the tire of choice very carefully.

VegasRPh

Here are some pics of the STOCK 235/45/17 size Michelins and my new Falken FK 452s in 245/45/17 size. I DID look at the 255/40/17, but I was concerned about the speedo difference and making the fender gap larger with a thinner sidewall tire. SINCE MY CAR IS A LEASE, I don't intend to drop it. Here is mine:

Type S with the 245/45/17 size:







Stock Michelins:

ctoro99

BEAR-AvHistory and Inaccurate,

When I first read the post by Inaccurate I was immediately sold since I have always been a fan of the Goodyear F1 DS. I was familiar with the ride and noise qualities of the tire. (would like to keep a quality ride) Reading that post just solidified my opinion. But now I have BEAR telling us that the Yoko AVS (same size) put over an inch of rubber on the road - a very appealing thought for me. The question I have is, with all else being equal (size according to manufacturer specs that is), how do the Yoko compare to the Goodyear on ride comfort, noise quality and even thread wear?

Like I said, I know the F1 is a very good tire w/ high ratings on the Tirerack site, but having a wider looking tire carries a lot of weight for me on this upgrade.

Also, there is some talk about the use of a 255/45/17 to fill the wheel well but I could not find that size on their website. Do they (Goodyear/Yokohoma) make this size tire?

BEAR-AvHistory

I have no idea, never had those specific Goodyear's to compare with, although I have had Goodyear's on other cars & never had any problems with them.

I have the ES-100's on my BMW 330ci for about 25,000+ miles & they are doing fine with plenty of rubber left.

They are certainly much better in the wear department then the BMW (OE) Continental tires that came with the performance package. They have outlasted one & a half sets of the Continental's so far.

My prior experience with them on the 330 is one of the reasons I chose them for the TL. Never noticed any noise so I expect its OK, but I have not really been looking for any.

As far as I know Yokohama does not offer a 45 aspect ratio in a 255, but the 255/40 was close enough to the stock tire in height to do what I wanted. One of my goals was to add a good bit more traction over the Bridgestone Potenze RE030's that came with the car without noticeably changing the look of the car.

Also its a minor point, but I was going to a wider tire to improve acceleration off the line somewhat & a taller tire like a 45 will have a small effect in reducing your effective gear ratio which hurts acceleration in the lower gears.

People that know tires will spot them from behind very quickly but most people will not give them a second glance.

That being said tires are like oil, oil filters & high octane gas on this forum. You will get a thousand opinions most of them disagreeing with each other.

Bearcat94

First, the "fill the wheel well" thing, if it exists at all, is mostly an illusion. You *should* be selecting a wheel/tire combo that is within ~3% of the stock diameter - most are around 1% - 1.5%. You may gain or lose ~1/4" of gap, but not much more.

Second, there was post (this thread or another) that basically said the Section Widths (255, 245, 235, etc) are well defined as the widest point of a given tire. These can be compared across manufactuers and brands.

However, the thread went on to point out that there is no standard to determine Tread Width. Some manufacturers include part or all of the shoulder and some don't. So BEAR's Yoko's and someone else's Goodyears (or BStones or whatever) might actually have very similar Tread Width IF they are measured the same way.

IOW - take the manufacturers numbers with a grain of salt and then go check for yourself.


Oops! Almost forgot. Only place I can think to get subjective comparision on the ride/noise qualities of the two tires in question is from the Tire Rack user survey's. For the Yoko and GY F1 I am not sure if they in the same performance category on Tire Rack or not. If not, I don't know if the ratings will be "apples-to-apples".

VegasRPh

As the tire gets WIDER on an 8" rim.............the tire will get TALLER.
P235/45/17 is STOCK size on our 17" X 8" rims..................SO, if you go to 245 or 255...... the tire will be WIDER, but it will also get TALLER..........the sidewall will "STAND UP".

I looked at a 255/40/17 on one of my wheels............it looked good, but I started to see that the "contact patch" wasn't sitting flush on the ground. Also, the sidewall was trying to STAND UP more...........since the tire was so wide.

I noticed this with my 245/45/17 size vs 235/45/17 stocks...........it's faint, but it's there.

BEAR-AvHistory

The best way to check the actual contact patch width, which will vary by car weight & air pressure, is to have the tire mounted & loaded with the cars weight then driven over a ruler to take a measurement.

Eventually the tires will were some & you will be able to see the contact patch as the warn area. This can vary somewhat based on the tire construction & how much lateral movement you get in cornering but it should be good enough for government work.

The 255/40/17 ES-100 on the front wheels puts down just slightly less then 10" on a 06 - 6MT @ 35lbs with a full tank of gas when run over a ruler. I weigh 210 but don't know how much that effects the tires contact patch.

The rears carry less vehicle weight, about a 60/40 distribution on the FWD, but only have 32lbs air in them, as per the door jam specs, to compensate for the reduced weight but I have not checked their contact patch.

S PAW 1

[QUOTE=VegasRPh]As the tire gets WIDER on an 8" rim.............the tire will get TALLER.


I don't believe that is necessarily true.
As the tire widens, the sidewall shortens, thus the diameter.

Bearcat94

[QUOTE=S PAW 1]
I think Vegas means the same size tire on different rim widths will change the sidewall profile.